About this Episode:

Building on last week’s episode, Paul, Jesse, and Mike discuss the origins of The Ways Paradigm and expand on the ways of understanding, being, and intervening in relationship to spirituality and/or religion in the counseling process.

About Jesse:

Jesse Fox, Ph.D., earned his degree from the University of Central Florida and spent several years on the faculty at Loyola University Maryland. He has experience working with a range of clinical populations that spans a college counseling, outpatient treatment, community mental health and private practice. His focuses primarily on contemplative practices, spirituality integrated counseling and the development of clinical decision-making or intuition. He is also an editorial board member for The Journal of Counseling and Development, Measurement and Evaluation in Counseling and Development, Counseling and Values and Counseling Outcome Research and Evaluation.

Jesse’s faculty page:

About Paul:

Dr. Paul Deal is a Nationally Certified Counselor with experience working with a diverse demographic of clients with a variety of presenting problems. His work as a clinician includes a college counseling center, an outpatient addictions program, and religious/spiritual communities. He also has extensive experience working with the families of struggling adolescents as a wilderness therapist. In addition to his experience as a clinician, Dr. Deal is active in scholarship, having contributed peer-reviewed publications, invited chapters, and presentations at the state and national level. His primary interests focus on integrating the existential and spiritual dynamics of human flourishing in mental health counseling, particularly in the areas of meaning-making in emerging adulthood, lived experiences of sacredness in environmental justice activism, and ecotherapy. Outside the classroom, Dr. Deal enjoys dabbling in the rich cultural practices that accompany Adirondack life.

Paul’s faculty page:


The APA Citation for this Episode:

Shook, M. (Producer). (2019, January 23). EP112: The Ways Paradigm (Part 2) – Ways of Understanding, Ways of Being, and Ways of Intervening with Paul Deal and Jesse Fox [Audio Podcast]. The Thoughtful Counselor. Retrieved from https://wp.me/p7R6fn-BJ.

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